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	<title>Comments on: Mastering the Hype Cycle by Fenn and Raskino</title>
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	<link>http://www.ribbonfarm.com/2008/10/16/mastering-the-hype-cycle-by-fenn-and-raskino/</link>
	<description>experiments in refactored perception</description>
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		<title>By: Is the Gartner Hype Cycle hyped? - Quora</title>
		<link>http://www.ribbonfarm.com/2008/10/16/mastering-the-hype-cycle-by-fenn-and-raskino/#comment-9607</link>
		<dc:creator>Is the Gartner Hype Cycle hyped? - Quora</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Feb 2011 04:52:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ribbonfarm.com/?p=442#comment-9607</guid>
		<description>[...] treatment, &quot;Mastering the Hype Cycle&quot; that provides some answers. Here is my review:http://www.ribbonfarm.com/2008/1...I think overall, it is a useful phenomenological and empirical model, but it isn&#039;t particularly [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] treatment, &quot;Mastering the Hype Cycle&quot; that provides some answers. Here is my review:<a href="http://www.ribbonfarm.com/2008/1...I" rel="nofollow">http://www.ribbonfarm.com/2008/1&#8230;I</a> think overall, it is a useful phenomenological and empirical model, but it isn&#039;t particularly [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Spotting Management Fads - Topic Research, Trends and Surveys</title>
		<link>http://www.ribbonfarm.com/2008/10/16/mastering-the-hype-cycle-by-fenn-and-raskino/#comment-5102</link>
		<dc:creator>Spotting Management Fads - Topic Research, Trends and Surveys</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 Jul 2010 12:31:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ribbonfarm.com/?p=442#comment-5102</guid>
		<description>[...] provide some humor and color, not just useful references. market research, surveys and trends      Mastering the Hype Cycle by Fenn and Raskino    You know you&#8217;ve got an interesting idea on your hands if it helps you build a fairly [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] provide some humor and color, not just useful references. market research, surveys and trends      Mastering the Hype Cycle by Fenn and Raskino    You know you&#8217;ve got an interesting idea on your hands if it helps you build a fairly [...]</p>
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		<title>By: A Social Media Capability Maturity Model</title>
		<link>http://www.ribbonfarm.com/2008/10/16/mastering-the-hype-cycle-by-fenn-and-raskino/#comment-2165</link>
		<dc:creator>A Social Media Capability Maturity Model</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 09 Feb 2009 13:07:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ribbonfarm.com/?p=442#comment-2165</guid>
		<description>[...] capability innovation. CMMs&#160; help guide significant change in an organization’s behavior. Hype cycles help you time the adoption decision. When a capability is first developed, everybody is fumbling [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] capability innovation. CMMs&nbsp; help guide significant change in an organization’s behavior. Hype cycles help you time the adoption decision. When a capability is first developed, everybody is fumbling [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Enterprise 2.0 Blog &#187; Blog Archive &#187; A Social Media Capability Maturity Model: Part I</title>
		<link>http://www.ribbonfarm.com/2008/10/16/mastering-the-hype-cycle-by-fenn-and-raskino/#comment-2153</link>
		<dc:creator>Enterprise 2.0 Blog &#187; Blog Archive &#187; A Social Media Capability Maturity Model: Part I</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Jan 2009 23:41:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ribbonfarm.com/?p=442#comment-2153</guid>
		<description>[...] capability innovation. CMMs  help guide significant change in an organization&#8217;s behavior. Hype cycles help you time the adoption decision. When a capability is first developed, everybody is fumbling [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] capability innovation. CMMs  help guide significant change in an organization&#8217;s behavior. Hype cycles help you time the adoption decision. When a capability is first developed, everybody is fumbling [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Jackie Fenn</title>
		<link>http://www.ribbonfarm.com/2008/10/16/mastering-the-hype-cycle-by-fenn-and-raskino/#comment-1440</link>
		<dc:creator>Jackie Fenn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 24 Oct 2008 16:26:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ribbonfarm.com/?p=442#comment-1440</guid>
		<description>Venkat: Thanks for the thorough and fair review – I found it funny and insightful, always a great combination. You also raise some interesting topics for further development, including the potential first-principles nature of the hype curve. Some kind of damped oscillation is certainly close and makes sense intuitively in terms of expectations converging on reality. However we haven’t yet managed to find a single equation for the shape of the curve - neither of us is a mathematician or physicist, so we have to rely on the kindness of friends and strangers to try and nail this one. If anyone out there is up for the challenge, we would love to see if a single equation exists, and if so, what it tells about the theoretical nature of the curve and what else it can be compared to.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Venkat: Thanks for the thorough and fair review – I found it funny and insightful, always a great combination. You also raise some interesting topics for further development, including the potential first-principles nature of the hype curve. Some kind of damped oscillation is certainly close and makes sense intuitively in terms of expectations converging on reality. However we haven’t yet managed to find a single equation for the shape of the curve &#8211; neither of us is a mathematician or physicist, so we have to rely on the kindness of friends and strangers to try and nail this one. If anyone out there is up for the challenge, we would love to see if a single equation exists, and if so, what it tells about the theoretical nature of the curve and what else it can be compared to.</p>
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		<title>By: Three more good reviews - thanks</title>
		<link>http://www.ribbonfarm.com/2008/10/16/mastering-the-hype-cycle-by-fenn-and-raskino/#comment-1419</link>
		<dc:creator>Three more good reviews - thanks</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 21 Oct 2008 15:38:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ribbonfarm.com/?p=442#comment-1419</guid>
		<description>[...] to Venkatesh Rao for his review at at ribbonfarm.com - I see my career as a series of HC waves surfed [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] to Venkatesh Rao for his review at at ribbonfarm.com &#8211; I see my career as a series of HC waves surfed [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Bobby</title>
		<link>http://www.ribbonfarm.com/2008/10/16/mastering-the-hype-cycle-by-fenn-and-raskino/#comment-1400</link>
		<dc:creator>Bobby</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 17 Oct 2008 17:23:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ribbonfarm.com/?p=442#comment-1400</guid>
		<description>Yeah, neat- I like the fractal idea for sure.  Also, I would like to think that my analysis would reflect actual adoption rates, and I wonder what kind of patterns would emerge as a sort of z axis to the visibility/time thing?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yeah, neat- I like the fractal idea for sure.  Also, I would like to think that my analysis would reflect actual adoption rates, and I wonder what kind of patterns would emerge as a sort of z axis to the visibility/time thing?</p>
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		<title>By: Venkat</title>
		<link>http://www.ribbonfarm.com/2008/10/16/mastering-the-hype-cycle-by-fenn-and-raskino/#comment-1398</link>
		<dc:creator>Venkat</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 17 Oct 2008 12:49:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ribbonfarm.com/?p=442#comment-1398</guid>
		<description>Okay, that&#039;s not quite so much shorting as it is bargain-hunting. Wonder if there IS an equivalent of shorting in an adoption tactic.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Okay, that&#8217;s not quite so much shorting as it is bargain-hunting. Wonder if there IS an equivalent of shorting in an adoption tactic.</p>
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		<title>By: Venkat</title>
		<link>http://www.ribbonfarm.com/2008/10/16/mastering-the-hype-cycle-by-fenn-and-raskino/#comment-1397</link>
		<dc:creator>Venkat</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 17 Oct 2008 12:46:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ribbonfarm.com/?p=442#comment-1397</guid>
		<description>Bobby:

Yes, what you are describing for Flickr is a classic diffusion process. Somewhere in the book the authors describe the characteristics of quick adoption, and visible use is one of them. 

The cycle is a &#039;typical&#039; example of a family, not the only pattern. The book lists some variants, like a two-peak curve (with a second small peak at the start of the slope of enlightenment) and &#039;high-flier&#039; vs &#039;low-flier&#039; curves for higher/lower plateaus etc.

I think the curve is likely to be a sort of fractal curve in reality, the somehow folds in lots of smaller cycles of peaks and troughs, but the way Gartner tracks it is based primarily on media reports I believe, not on every bug and every release version of s/w. That, as you say, would be a very noisy signal.

Tom:

Good point about survivorship bias. The book does suggest that lots of hype cycles never make it past the trough, such as in the case of the more vacuous management fads. They do not propose any leading indicators at the trigger/peak stage (such as &quot;if all early adopters have green beards, the thing will fail in the trough.&quot;). 

Overall, I don&#039;t view the hype cycle as a particularly good predictive tool. Though the authors have bits of the book devoted to &quot;spotting&quot; the peaks and troughs, they aren&#039;t very convincing. I think it is best to treat the hype cycle as a conceptual and retrospective-analytical tool, whose evolution can only be observed with a short lag.

Predicting the peak/trough and especially the onset of the slope, without fundamental analysis of what the curve is tracking, is obviously going to be as difficult as timing the stock market. But with technological analysis, it should be possible, since developments will actually mean something.

I think the best way to understand the value of the cycle is to compare somebody, say A, who thinks with the HC model vs. somebody, say B, who believes a more naive model (say monotonic exponential or worse, a ramp or step function hype signature). 

At the very least, A sees and can take advantage of one opportunity B cannot: the equivalent of shorting a stock, by investing in a technology via fire sales after a peak, getting stuff dirt cheap and then persevering through the trough.

Venkat</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Bobby:</p>
<p>Yes, what you are describing for Flickr is a classic diffusion process. Somewhere in the book the authors describe the characteristics of quick adoption, and visible use is one of them. </p>
<p>The cycle is a &#8216;typical&#8217; example of a family, not the only pattern. The book lists some variants, like a two-peak curve (with a second small peak at the start of the slope of enlightenment) and &#8216;high-flier&#8217; vs &#8216;low-flier&#8217; curves for higher/lower plateaus etc.</p>
<p>I think the curve is likely to be a sort of fractal curve in reality, the somehow folds in lots of smaller cycles of peaks and troughs, but the way Gartner tracks it is based primarily on media reports I believe, not on every bug and every release version of s/w. That, as you say, would be a very noisy signal.</p>
<p>Tom:</p>
<p>Good point about survivorship bias. The book does suggest that lots of hype cycles never make it past the trough, such as in the case of the more vacuous management fads. They do not propose any leading indicators at the trigger/peak stage (such as &#8220;if all early adopters have green beards, the thing will fail in the trough.&#8221;). </p>
<p>Overall, I don&#8217;t view the hype cycle as a particularly good predictive tool. Though the authors have bits of the book devoted to &#8220;spotting&#8221; the peaks and troughs, they aren&#8217;t very convincing. I think it is best to treat the hype cycle as a conceptual and retrospective-analytical tool, whose evolution can only be observed with a short lag.</p>
<p>Predicting the peak/trough and especially the onset of the slope, without fundamental analysis of what the curve is tracking, is obviously going to be as difficult as timing the stock market. But with technological analysis, it should be possible, since developments will actually mean something.</p>
<p>I think the best way to understand the value of the cycle is to compare somebody, say A, who thinks with the HC model vs. somebody, say B, who believes a more naive model (say monotonic exponential or worse, a ramp or step function hype signature). </p>
<p>At the very least, A sees and can take advantage of one opportunity B cannot: the equivalent of shorting a stock, by investing in a technology via fire sales after a peak, getting stuff dirt cheap and then persevering through the trough.</p>
<p>Venkat</p>
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		<title>By: Bobby</title>
		<link>http://www.ribbonfarm.com/2008/10/16/mastering-the-hype-cycle-by-fenn-and-raskino/#comment-1392</link>
		<dc:creator>Bobby</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 17 Oct 2008 04:36:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ribbonfarm.com/?p=442#comment-1392</guid>
		<description>dug around some more... would you call that a diffusion model?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>dug around some more&#8230; would you call that a diffusion model?</p>
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		<title>By: Bobby</title>
		<link>http://www.ribbonfarm.com/2008/10/16/mastering-the-hype-cycle-by-fenn-and-raskino/#comment-1391</link>
		<dc:creator>Bobby</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 17 Oct 2008 04:11:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ribbonfarm.com/?p=442#comment-1391</guid>
		<description>Really great, thanks.

I wonder about the curve applying generally to many web 2.0 services that evolve via a beta model... would you say that each release has it&#039;s own curve? I mean, many of the 2.0 applications out there are launching, developing, and (hopefully) improving, at a rate which creates a volume of information that is fairly unmanageable for individuals... and so the channels of distribution tend to be more non-traditional.  I wonder how the curve will hold up as the rate at which technologies develop becomes increasingly exponential and the noise that occurs when information starts to exceed capacity begins to make it even more difficult to keep up with new developments...

I think a good example would be flickr. I wouldn&#039;t say that flickr is still considered the darling of early adopters, my parents use it. I would argue that they have steadily grown the user base by focusing on quietly improving from the get go, and relying on the web&#039;s &quot;grapevine&quot; to spread the word.  I really don&#039;t recall a real flickr hype, personally (other than the Yahoo purchase, but is that the same kind of hype?), just running across a friends stream and thinking &quot;oh, neat.&quot;  I certainly never saw flickr advertised anywhere... and I&#039;m willing to bet their adoption rate has been pretty steady.

agreeing that it&#039;s not the best way to gauge:

http://www.google.com/trends?q=flickr%2C+second+life&amp;ctab=0&amp;geo=all&amp;date=all&amp;sort=0</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Really great, thanks.</p>
<p>I wonder about the curve applying generally to many web 2.0 services that evolve via a beta model&#8230; would you say that each release has it&#8217;s own curve? I mean, many of the 2.0 applications out there are launching, developing, and (hopefully) improving, at a rate which creates a volume of information that is fairly unmanageable for individuals&#8230; and so the channels of distribution tend to be more non-traditional.  I wonder how the curve will hold up as the rate at which technologies develop becomes increasingly exponential and the noise that occurs when information starts to exceed capacity begins to make it even more difficult to keep up with new developments&#8230;</p>
<p>I think a good example would be flickr. I wouldn&#8217;t say that flickr is still considered the darling of early adopters, my parents use it. I would argue that they have steadily grown the user base by focusing on quietly improving from the get go, and relying on the web&#8217;s &#8220;grapevine&#8221; to spread the word.  I really don&#8217;t recall a real flickr hype, personally (other than the Yahoo purchase, but is that the same kind of hype?), just running across a friends stream and thinking &#8220;oh, neat.&#8221;  I certainly never saw flickr advertised anywhere&#8230; and I&#8217;m willing to bet their adoption rate has been pretty steady.</p>
<p>agreeing that it&#8217;s not the best way to gauge:</p>
<p><a href="http://www.google.com/trends?q=flickr%2C+second+life&#038;ctab=0&#038;geo=all&#038;date=all&#038;sort=0" rel="nofollow">http://www.google.com/trends?q=flickr%2C+second+life&#038;ctab=0&#038;geo=all&#038;date=all&#038;sort=0</a></p>
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		<title>By: Tom K</title>
		<link>http://www.ribbonfarm.com/2008/10/16/mastering-the-hype-cycle-by-fenn-and-raskino/#comment-1390</link>
		<dc:creator>Tom K</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 17 Oct 2008 02:39:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ribbonfarm.com/?p=442#comment-1390</guid>
		<description>Your digest of this book reminds me a problem that has bothered me for some time that stems from the general shape of hype cycles or other such similar things.  The thesis has always been that there are predictable patterns behind trends that proceed in a more or less standard way through the growing pains of adoption.  But are these learnings not wrought with survivor bias?  For any trend that survives many more crash and burn never to follow that path.  Only in a retrospective way can you trace that path.  Many trends in the end appear as short lived fads.  Google trends analysis can bring that out, but we don’t yet have enough data to generate a statistical argument.  Does this book shed some light on predicting which emerging trends will die outright and which will ride the hype roller coaster?

Tom K</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Your digest of this book reminds me a problem that has bothered me for some time that stems from the general shape of hype cycles or other such similar things.  The thesis has always been that there are predictable patterns behind trends that proceed in a more or less standard way through the growing pains of adoption.  But are these learnings not wrought with survivor bias?  For any trend that survives many more crash and burn never to follow that path.  Only in a retrospective way can you trace that path.  Many trends in the end appear as short lived fads.  Google trends analysis can bring that out, but we don’t yet have enough data to generate a statistical argument.  Does this book shed some light on predicting which emerging trends will die outright and which will ride the hype roller coaster?</p>
<p>Tom K</p>
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