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	<title>Comments on: Towards a Philosophy of Destruction</title>
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	<link>http://www.ribbonfarm.com/2008/07/21/towards-a-philosophy-of-destruction/</link>
	<description>experiments in refactored perception</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Wed, 08 Feb 2012 02:42:12 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: Bookmarks about Tipping</title>
		<link>http://www.ribbonfarm.com/2008/07/21/towards-a-philosophy-of-destruction/#comment-1347</link>
		<dc:creator>Bookmarks about Tipping</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 01 Oct 2008 08:00:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ribbonfarm.com/?p=303#comment-1347</guid>
		<description>[...] - bookmarked by 3 members originally found by KevinEldon on 2008-09-11  Towards a Philosophy of Destruction  http://www.ribbonfarm.com/2008/07/21/towards-a-philosophy-of-destruction/ - bookmarked by 5 [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] &#8211; bookmarked by 3 members originally found by KevinEldon on 2008-09-11  Towards a Philosophy of Destruction  <a href="http://www.ribbonfarm.com/2008/07/21/towards-a-philosophy-of-destruction/" rel="nofollow">http://www.ribbonfarm.com/2008/07/21/towards-a-philosophy-of-destruction/</a> &#8211; bookmarked by 5 [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Venkat</title>
		<link>http://www.ribbonfarm.com/2008/07/21/towards-a-philosophy-of-destruction/#comment-1113</link>
		<dc:creator>Venkat</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 01 Aug 2008 00:41:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ribbonfarm.com/?p=303#comment-1113</guid>
		<description>Now that makes MUCH more sense :) I&#039;d always misheard it as hansi. But &#039;laughter&#039; accidentally works neatly too, don&#039;t you think?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Now that makes MUCH more sense <img src='http://www.ribbonfarm.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' />  I&#8217;d always misheard it as hansi. But &#8216;laughter&#8217; accidentally works neatly too, don&#8217;t you think?</p>
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		<title>By: Manjunath</title>
		<link>http://www.ribbonfarm.com/2008/07/21/towards-a-philosophy-of-destruction/#comment-1112</link>
		<dc:creator>Manjunath</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 31 Jul 2008 09:18:53 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Dear Venkat,

just a little correction on Sahir&#039;s wonderful poetry. The 2nd line of the mukhDa reads thus:

Pal do pal meri &#039;hasti&#039; hai, pal do pal meri jawani hai.

Hasti = existence

Regards,
Manju</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dear Venkat,</p>
<p>just a little correction on Sahir&#8217;s wonderful poetry. The 2nd line of the mukhDa reads thus:</p>
<p>Pal do pal meri &#8216;hasti&#8217; hai, pal do pal meri jawani hai.</p>
<p>Hasti = existence</p>
<p>Regards,<br />
Manju</p>
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		<title>By: Venkat</title>
		<link>http://www.ribbonfarm.com/2008/07/21/towards-a-philosophy-of-destruction/#comment-1111</link>
		<dc:creator>Venkat</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 27 Jul 2008 15:38:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ribbonfarm.com/?p=303#comment-1111</guid>
		<description>See... you naturally jump to creative-destruction or plain creativity when you think of this stuff! You went off on a fun riff going from evolution to supernovas, and destruction per se got lost. Destruction never gets an appropriate share of the attention. Forget the better deer and the faster tigers. Focus on the killed deer and starving tiger in isolation. What can we say about that? I have a friend who is a major animal rights activists and I once challenged him on the question of pain caused to animals by other animals, and his moral stance on that. Did he think, in fact, that robotic tofu-deer should be released into the wild so lions could live a pseudo-full life without creating pain? I meant that as a reductio ad absurdum of a first-cause-no-pain ethical system, but he stuck to his guns and said yes to tofu deer.

On Sisyphus vs. Wile E. Coyote... you missed the point in that comparison. The reason Sisyphus is  so interesting (and no, it ain&#039;t reverence for ancient greeks...more for Camus&#039; reconstruction) is the &lt;i&gt;absurdity&lt;/i&gt; of his situation. There are 2 differences between Sisyphus and Wile E. One is that Sisyphus &lt;i&gt;knows&lt;/i&gt; the rock will never stay at the top of the hill (that&#039;s the rule of his punishment). The second is that Sisyphus&#039; predicament is absurd. As you say, Wile E. has a meaningful goal (full stomach). Sisyphus must somehow construct meaning from his entirely meaningless goal. And do so knowing that his victory even in this meaningless goal will be fleeting and gone in an instant as the rock rolls back down.

I have to admit, much as I agree with you that Greek references are overused, Sisyphus is one story that I have found no equivalent to anywhere. If you know of one with the same characteristics (known impossibility of success and absurdity of goals), I&#039;d like to know.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>See&#8230; you naturally jump to creative-destruction or plain creativity when you think of this stuff! You went off on a fun riff going from evolution to supernovas, and destruction per se got lost. Destruction never gets an appropriate share of the attention. Forget the better deer and the faster tigers. Focus on the killed deer and starving tiger in isolation. What can we say about that? I have a friend who is a major animal rights activists and I once challenged him on the question of pain caused to animals by other animals, and his moral stance on that. Did he think, in fact, that robotic tofu-deer should be released into the wild so lions could live a pseudo-full life without creating pain? I meant that as a reductio ad absurdum of a first-cause-no-pain ethical system, but he stuck to his guns and said yes to tofu deer.</p>
<p>On Sisyphus vs. Wile E. Coyote&#8230; you missed the point in that comparison. The reason Sisyphus is  so interesting (and no, it ain&#8217;t reverence for ancient greeks&#8230;more for Camus&#8217; reconstruction) is the <i>absurdity</i> of his situation. There are 2 differences between Sisyphus and Wile E. One is that Sisyphus <i>knows</i> the rock will never stay at the top of the hill (that&#8217;s the rule of his punishment). The second is that Sisyphus&#8217; predicament is absurd. As you say, Wile E. has a meaningful goal (full stomach). Sisyphus must somehow construct meaning from his entirely meaningless goal. And do so knowing that his victory even in this meaningless goal will be fleeting and gone in an instant as the rock rolls back down.</p>
<p>I have to admit, much as I agree with you that Greek references are overused, Sisyphus is one story that I have found no equivalent to anywhere. If you know of one with the same characteristics (known impossibility of success and absurdity of goals), I&#8217;d like to know.</p>
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		<title>By: tubelite</title>
		<link>http://www.ribbonfarm.com/2008/07/21/towards-a-philosophy-of-destruction/#comment-1106</link>
		<dc:creator>tubelite</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 Jul 2008 17:06:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ribbonfarm.com/?p=303#comment-1106</guid>
		<description>Quick thoughts:

Creative destruction shows up at its best in evolution. Look at a tiger chasing a herd of deer and picking up the slowest straggler. By definition - mathematically, in fact -  that act of destruction has improved the average speed of the herd and, over time, its genes. (The inverse is the tiger who is too slow to catch anything - by his death of starvation, the average tiger is improved)

And let&#039;s not forget the most spectacular own-goal in all of history - anaerobic bacteria poisoning the atmosphere with oxygen, almost wiping themselves out, but in the process paving the way for oxygen based life forms. Perhaps we are merely returning the favour now...

We are unlikely to destroy life itself, no matter what stunt we pull. But think of life as the most interesting phenomenon in the universe, bubbling and frothing and teeming on the surface of the only known Goldilocks planet. A few bits of froth even burst forth to briefly touch the moon, before falling back to earth.

The only way to keep this interesting stuff happening is to leap right off the planet and keep going... and it&#039;s taken about half the lifetime of the sun to get to the point where the self-replicating bags of chemical soup have a chance in hell of doing it. And if instead, they get sidetracked into blowing themselves up spectacularly, there may not be enough time for a repeat performance. Only a few billion years left before the Sun calls it a day and goes nova, which - who knows - may give another star system a legacy of gold and silver and iron and all the other heavy elements which make life worth living :)

Why Sisyphus? Why must our metaphors be limited to the imagination of the ancient Greeks? I give you a far better Sisyphus than Sisyphus: one who dwells in a stark, rocky desert landscape, whose eternal optimism and (often) ground-breaking technical innovations are always thwarted by a universe which is not merely capricious but actually malicious; flouting its own laws to keep him from attaining the basic goal of all living things: a full stomach.
Wile E. Coyote, I salute you.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Quick thoughts:</p>
<p>Creative destruction shows up at its best in evolution. Look at a tiger chasing a herd of deer and picking up the slowest straggler. By definition &#8211; mathematically, in fact &#8211;  that act of destruction has improved the average speed of the herd and, over time, its genes. (The inverse is the tiger who is too slow to catch anything &#8211; by his death of starvation, the average tiger is improved)</p>
<p>And let&#8217;s not forget the most spectacular own-goal in all of history &#8211; anaerobic bacteria poisoning the atmosphere with oxygen, almost wiping themselves out, but in the process paving the way for oxygen based life forms. Perhaps we are merely returning the favour now&#8230;</p>
<p>We are unlikely to destroy life itself, no matter what stunt we pull. But think of life as the most interesting phenomenon in the universe, bubbling and frothing and teeming on the surface of the only known Goldilocks planet. A few bits of froth even burst forth to briefly touch the moon, before falling back to earth.</p>
<p>The only way to keep this interesting stuff happening is to leap right off the planet and keep going&#8230; and it&#8217;s taken about half the lifetime of the sun to get to the point where the self-replicating bags of chemical soup have a chance in hell of doing it. And if instead, they get sidetracked into blowing themselves up spectacularly, there may not be enough time for a repeat performance. Only a few billion years left before the Sun calls it a day and goes nova, which &#8211; who knows &#8211; may give another star system a legacy of gold and silver and iron and all the other heavy elements which make life worth living <img src='http://www.ribbonfarm.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>Why Sisyphus? Why must our metaphors be limited to the imagination of the ancient Greeks? I give you a far better Sisyphus than Sisyphus: one who dwells in a stark, rocky desert landscape, whose eternal optimism and (often) ground-breaking technical innovations are always thwarted by a universe which is not merely capricious but actually malicious; flouting its own laws to keep him from attaining the basic goal of all living things: a full stomach.<br />
Wile E. Coyote, I salute you.</p>
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